Johnney Guinness, what do you think? (smile)

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Must not conflict resolve by suggesting that someone should go sit on an ice pick...

Robert,
Lets be really clear here. The Bible says that YOUR ancestors lived down Iraq, the Bible calls it "Babylon", and it happened 6,000 years ago, 4,004 BC; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ussher_chronology

Robert while it currently seems difficult to believe this biblical fiction type story of God creating humans, its going to turn out to be true in the end.

In the end Robert, and we are very very close to that date, science will prove this! Science will prove precisely what happened. And the whole world will be in shock, both atheists, and religious people.

This is what happened in short form;
1. People, who were human beings just like you and me, came here to Earth about 20,000 years ago, ROUGHLY!

2. The people who came here to this planet, the human beings, were scientists. Specifically they were "Genetic engineers"; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_engineering

3. They spent several thousand years creating brand new plants and animals, through genetic engineering. There were thousands of Scientists! There were thousands of these genetic engineers that came here to create new plants and animals. And they were doing this for several thousand years.

4. When they were finished creating all the plants and animals you see today, then they took their own genes, they genetically engineered them, and created us human beings. This event of creating the first new human being happened around 4,004 BC. Just to distinguish between them and us, there is a small genetic difference between them and us. They live longer than us! Other than that, they are the same as us.

5. After they created us humans, they chose not to give us all the scientific knowledge they had. So they only gave us enough basic science for us to survive and live peaceful lives. From this point onward, you have the whole bible that tells you all the rest.

6. Just to clarify; The dinosaurs and fossils we dig up from the ground are very very very ancient relics from a completely different epoch of life, millions of years back when this planet, Earth, was previously used by the same human scientists as for genetic engineering experiments.

Robert, please, please, please.....don't be fooled by them. Be careful my friend. Hugh amounts of the scientific knowledge we have today are 100% correct. But Robert....Hugh amounts of the science we have today are also 100% wrong. The whole "evolution" story is fiction, it never happened.

Good luck my friend,
Johnney.

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Thanks John,

I will be careful. I was happy to find someone the agreed with you.

I'll be careful.

Be good,
Robert

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Must not conflict resolve by suggesting that someone should go sit on an ice pick...

As long as 500,000 years ago hominoids were making tools and living in cooperative societies. There is indisputable evidence that we branched off from a gibbon-like ape about 6 million years ago.

The evidence is written in the fossil record and in the DNA which is a much more reliable chronicle than the Bible.

We differ from the Chimpanzee by very little and are closer relatives to chimps than are gorillas.

I am always surprised by the fact that nobody has read the works of Pierre Teilhard de Chardin, SJ. Read his 'Le phenomene humain". He was a palaentologist and the discover of the "Peking man" whose remains were lost due to the Japanese invasion of China. He is buried in New York.
Tullio

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As long as 500,000 years ago hominoids were making tools and living in cooperative societies. There is indisputable evidence that we branched off from a gibbon-like ape about 6 million years ago.

The evidence is written in the fossil record and in the DNA which is a much more reliable chronicle than the Bible.

We differ from the Chimpanzee by very little and are closer relatives to chimps than are gorillas.

Daddio,
My old friend. My good friend. My old friend that used to share scientific debates with me. My friend that chatted with me on Skype and debated scientific topics with me. My friend that helped with our team stuff for years and years. I won't lie to you Bill. I speak the truth!

Bill they have fooled you. They have blinded you with science about how your ancestors slowly evolved over time. And Bill, your unable decipher if the scientific information is true or false.

Try to understand this Bill;
You are not an "expert" in evolutionary biology. Either are 99.9999999% of the people on this planet. In fact there are only a few thousand "evolutionary biologists" in all the universities of the world. Its this tiny number of evolutionary biologists, about 500 of them, that are "steering" the much larger "global scientific community". Because scientists tend to just trust each others work, everyone just kinda accepts the evolution story. They accept evolution because of a lack of any other logical reason for how life got started.

Bill you will find out in time, very soon that the evolution story is a lie. Its the genetic engineers that will over power the evolutionary biologists in the end. Genetic engineering is the "King" of all sciences. And we are very close to a point in time where the genetic engineers will start to speak out about the flaws in evolution theory.

Bill i don't know if you know who Craig Venter is? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Craig_Venter

Craig Venter is the worlds most famous genetic engineer because of his work on the human genome project.

Watch a Youtube video with Craig Venter and Richard Dawkins debating God and the origins of life. In this clip, Craig Venter denies that the evolutionary "tree of life" exists; Craig Venter saying the "Tree of life" is an artifact of early studies that aren't really holding up;
No Darwin Tree of Life .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zqaXVqmcDVI (1 minute video)

Watch the full debate;
University of Arizona debate with Craig Venter, Richard Dawkins and others
The Great Debate - What is Life? .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIHMnD2FDeY (41 minutes long)

The so called "Theory of evolution" is about to come crumbling down in the next few years. Evolution never happened!

John.

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JW link

I am not a JW (heaven forbid) but what are the views on their "Was life created" booklet?

I don't know Chris. I'm a scientist, religion is not my area of expertise.

John.

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And i would just like to clarify something about ME!

I'm not gone from these forums! I have just backed off from the debates to concentrate on my research.

My research is going very well. I have made massive progress in the last few months deciphering and decoding the "old book" that i have spoken about so many times on these forums. The research continues, non stop, full time, full speed ahead!

John.

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Johnnie my son.

Yes I am not an evolutionary biologist. But I would think that any self respecting college or University would claim to have one or more. You really can't be much of a biologist without dealing with evolution these days. Perhaps we can take a course in same so as to argue and discuss on a more intelligent level.

As for DNA--it's a record of the evolution of life on earth. Like it or not you share 18% of your genes with a common weed. Yeast about 25%

So you have as your ancestors some very primitive life forms.

Cheers rite mate !!

Oh yeah!

Please correct me if I am wrong, but as far as I know, both Johnney Guinness, Intelligent Design and myself have been banished several times on these message boards over times.

One of the reasons for this except king alcohol (or at least beer) is faith, or rather lack of such.

As a general rule of thumb, we prefer to choose good before bad, but in reality it may not always end up being so.

Are we supposed to be learning anything of scientific value from things which may be related to faith and religion?

Where is science when it comes to this right now? Many people are atheists or agnostic, meaning that an approach to this subject may be considered somewhat difficult.

So, the question is then. Where to look for "scientific" evidence when it comes to questions about religion and faith.

Are some sciences (or subject fields of sciences) supposed to be better than others?

Again, not churchgoing and worshipping. That is not the major point here.

Thanks for any advice!

Johnnie my son.

Yes I am not an evolutionary biologist. But I would think that any self respecting college or University would claim to have one or more. You really can't be much of a biologist without dealing with evolution these days. Perhaps we can take a course in same so as to argue and discuss on a more intelligent level.

As for DNA--it's a record of the evolution of life on earth. Like it or not you share 18% of your genes with a common weed. Yeast about 25%

So you have as your ancestors some very primitive life forms.

Cheers rite mate !!

Bill,
I don't really know what to say to you. The reality is this; Your doing the correct thing in siding with the mainstream view, the majority view. I agree Bill, this is the logical thing to do. In science, if your not an expert in a specific area, but you tend to trust science, you tend to side with the majority. This is logical.

But!!! By siding with the majority on a general topic like evolution, then someone else is making your mind up for you. Your just reading their theories and hypothesise and, because you don't have the time and money to check their facts, you just accept whatever they say. Your forced to just agree with them, even if they are wrong, or don't yet have a definitive answer to a scientific question.

As a result Bill, your being deceived. The question of whether living things evolve, or if someone created them all, is not yet answered. But the evolutionary biologists present their science in such a way that it appears 100% valid and it appears like there is no other alternative.

There is an overwhelming amount of scientific evidence against living things "evolving" by themselves. But even scientists who work in the field of evolutionary biology just don't bother saying anything about the evidence because they would have to fight the whole scientific community just to discuss the evidence. So in the end, they just don't bother to say anything. They keep their mouths shut. And after all, the other alternative is "God did it", and you just can't say that in science!

So Bill thats why the evolution story is still the most popular theory today in mainstream science. Its popular, not because its brilliant and flawless science, but because its the only theory other than the God theory. So its just accepted.

Nobody is even considering that "God" might just be human beings.....people, just like you and me. Nobody is even considering that there was a race of human beings that lived here on earth thousands of years ago that had hugh amounts of scientific knowledge and it went unrecorded. Because that is what really happened. And that is what is described in the Bible.

I'm not fighting for the Bible because of some blind faith i have in the book. I'm fighting for the bible because, when its interpreted properly, it fits what actually happened in our human history.

John.

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Oh yeah!

Please correct me if I am wrong, but as far as I know, both Johnney Guinness, Intelligent Design and myself have been banished several times on these message boards over times.

One of the reasons for this except king alcohol (or at least beer) is faith, or rather lack of such.

As a general rule of thumb, we prefer to choose good before bad, but in reality it may not always end up being so.

Are we supposed to be learning anything of scientific value from things which may be related to faith and religion?

Where is science when it comes to this right now? Many people are atheists or agnostic, meaning that an approach to this subject may be considered somewhat difficult.

So, the question is then. Where to look for "scientific" evidence when it comes to questions about religion and faith.

Are some sciences (or subject fields of sciences) supposed to be better than others?

Again, not churchgoing and worshipping. That is not the major point here.

Thanks for any advice!

Look up "Junk DNA" and come back and tell me what you have found. To me there is no such thing.

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Must not conflict resolve by suggesting that someone should go sit on an ice pick...

Oh, if I ever happened to be with BT, I would not have told anyone a word.

Trust me.

JW link

I am not a JW (heaven forbid) but what are the views on their "Was life created" booklet?

I don't know Chris. I'm a scientist, religion is not my area of expertise.

John.

They quote a lot of science and say the bible is wrong! Could be worth you having a read, its not very long.

Chris

Chris,
No, they don't say the bible is wrong......no they don't!

To cut a long story short, in that book called "Was Life Created?", the Jehovah’s Witnesses say the bible needs to be interpreted. They say the 7 days of creation talked about in the Book of Genesis are not literally seven 24 hour days.

Chris this is generally accepted in all the worlds religions. None of the religions have the full complete story. So your forced to interpret what the words mean. So really, the Jehovah’s Witnesses are saying exactly the same thing as all the other Christian religions.

This is my personal interpretation of Genesis;
The Book of Genesis is written in such a way that it seems to be intentionally written to make scientists (doubting Thomases) reject the book. If your a scientist, and your reading the Book of Genesis to scientifically investigate the story, your forced to reject the book after reading the first paragraph. Its so blatantly wrong, no rational thinking person could accept it.

If you read the full first page of Genesis, it gets worse the further you read. The statements get more and more outlandish, and they border into being plain ridiculous. The statements are so ridiculous in Genesis, that even a primitive person with little or no science education is left baffled and speechless.

My conclusion from reading Genesis;
The Book of Genesis is so blatantly and intentionally wrong, the only person that would have written something like that is a scientist who is intentionally trying to trip up another scientist. I'm saying that only a scientist with hugh amounts of science would have written something that is so blatantly wrong. And his motive for writing such blatantly wrong science is to keep other scientists for reading the book. In short, i think the Book of Genesis is reverse psychology, intentionally written to make other scientists reject the book.

Its for that reason, its because the Book of Genesis is so blatantly wrong, draws me into investigating the story further. The whole Bible, from start to finish, is riddled with what i call "reverse scientific psychology". In other words, the author intentionally didn't want scientists to read the Bible. For that reason, i now scientifically investigate the Bible full time. I'm convinced that the author of the Book of Genesis could only have been a scientist. No one, not even a primate priest, would be dumb enough to write something that is so outrageous and so wrong. The Bible could only have been written by scientists, lots of them, all working together, studying the reverse psychology, and wording the statements to keep other scientists from reading it.

Why would a load of scientists do something like that?
Answer - To protect humanity from the destructive capabilities of scientific knowledge. On the surface, science is very cool and enlightening. But the truth is, having scientific knowledge just allows you to build bigger and bigger weapons to kill other people. So they did it to protect us, or to keep us away from scientific knowledge for as long as they could. But at the same time, they have coded incredible things into the Bible that will only be discovered in the "end times". Those end times are now! Because right now we are discovering the wonders of science and what you can do with it. And truth is, no scientist today in his right mind is going to read the bible to try to discover these hidden codes. The story is just too unbelieveable, and nobody would take it seriously. Therefore, the coded information won't be decoded until someone like me, with "Faith", goes and investigates it.

John.

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