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existance of god
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Dave(The Admiral)Nelson Send message Joined: 4 Jun 99 Posts: 415 Credit: 22,293,483 RAC: 1 |
[quote]What is nothing. There is no such thing as nothing. Dave Nelson |
janneseti Send message Joined: 14 Oct 09 Posts: 14106 Credit: 655,366 RAC: 0 |
I read the link. To me life seems to be a steady state and not increasing entropy. Given that it will be a delay on the onset of increasing entropy over time. |
janneseti Send message Joined: 14 Oct 09 Posts: 14106 Credit: 655,366 RAC: 0 |
[quote]What is nothing. Then the Big Bang never happened. Well there are many scientist today that question that theory. |
Dave(The Admiral)Nelson Send message Joined: 4 Jun 99 Posts: 415 Credit: 22,293,483 RAC: 1 |
I believe that there is no such as nothing because I am unable to visualize nothing. Are you? Dave Nelson |
Sarge Send message Joined: 25 Aug 99 Posts: 12273 Credit: 8,569,109 RAC: 79 |
I read the link. Could it be that atoms organizing into a life form, and then our attempts to organize our lives into schedules and tidy homes are what he thinks delays entropy? Could it be that our efforts simply speed up entropy elsewhere in the universe? In other words, is there a rate at which entropy is supposed to occur? Is it a constant or an average? If it is an average, then increasing organization in one locality would lead to decreasing organization in another neighborhood. Maybe? |
Darth Beaver Send message Joined: 20 Aug 99 Posts: 6728 Credit: 21,443,075 RAC: 3 |
Could it be that atoms organizing into a life form, and then our attempts to organize our lives into schedules and tidy homes are what he thinks delays entropy? Could it be that our efforts simply speed up entropy elsewhere in the universe? In other words, is there a rate at which entropy is supposed to occur? Is it a constant or an average? If it is an average, then increasing organization in one locality would lead to decreasing organization in another neighborhood. Maybe? That actually makes cents . 4 mass extinction since Earth was formed ? Is our time coming to a end , the great experiment of intelligence ?? |
janneseti Send message Joined: 14 Oct 09 Posts: 14106 Credit: 655,366 RAC: 0 |
I believe that there is no such as nothing because I am unable to visualize nothing. Are you? I can't visualize nothing. Nor God. The same goes for a singularity and the quantum world. Funny though that you can discuss those very abstract concepts. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nothing |
bobby Send message Joined: 22 Mar 02 Posts: 2866 Credit: 17,789,109 RAC: 3 |
I read the link. That's what the link I provided earlier was intended to show. I was told the linked page was read and afterwards the "life violates the 2nd law" claim remained. I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ... |
janneseti Send message Joined: 14 Oct 09 Posts: 14106 Credit: 655,366 RAC: 0 |
Could it be that atoms organizing into a life form, and then our attempts to organize our lives into schedules and tidy homes are what he thinks delays entropy? Could it be that our efforts simply speed up entropy elsewhere in the universe? In other words, is there a rate at which entropy is supposed to occur? Is it a constant or an average? If it is an average, then increasing organization in one locality would lead to decreasing organization in another neighborhood. Maybe? My "claim" was only that there is a LOCAL decrease in entropy when it comes to life — while at the same time the TOTAL entropy increases. Is there some other physical laws that behave in the same manner? Gravity? Don't think so. |
Sarge Send message Joined: 25 Aug 99 Posts: 12273 Credit: 8,569,109 RAC: 79 |
I read the link. In the meantime, I didn't read the link. One might be surprised at how little science I had to take at the Bachelor's degree level. So, since it's been so many years since I had Physics, I could only look at it mathematically and then ask "is there a rate and, if so, a constant or an average?" |
Sarge Send message Joined: 25 Aug 99 Posts: 12273 Credit: 8,569,109 RAC: 79 |
Could it be that atoms organizing into a life form, and then our attempts to organize our lives into schedules and tidy homes are what he thinks delays entropy? Could it be that our efforts simply speed up entropy elsewhere in the universe? In other words, is there a rate at which entropy is supposed to occur? Is it a constant or an average? If it is an average, then increasing organization in one locality would lead to decreasing organization in another neighborhood. Maybe? My attempts to decrease my own entropy might be sapping the life from a 90 year old in Japan, or a walrus? |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 30701 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
Could it be that atoms organizing into a life form, and then our attempts to organize our lives into schedules and tidy homes are what he thinks delays entropy? Could it be that our efforts simply speed up entropy elsewhere in the universe? In other words, is there a rate at which entropy is supposed to occur? Is it a constant or an average? If it is an average, then increasing organization in one locality would lead to decreasing organization in another neighborhood. Maybe? I think entropy is being misunderstood. Life is chemistry at its basic core. I remember something about ATP back a long time ago in school. When you sweep the floor, you get hot, so while the dust gets removed lowering disorder, you being hot increases disorder. All of life works that way. |
Es99 Send message Joined: 23 Aug 05 Posts: 10874 Credit: 350,402 RAC: 0 |
You did statistics though. Entropy is a statistical calculation, so like any statistical calculation there can be apparent regions of order while the disorder of the entire system is increasing. Reality Internet Personality |
Sarge Send message Joined: 25 Aug 99 Posts: 12273 Credit: 8,569,109 RAC: 79 |
In the meantime, I didn't read the link. In the end, yes, quite a bit of Stats, learning it and teaching it. So, is there an average rate? And can someone please remind me how this fits in to the thread topic? |
Es99 Send message Joined: 23 Aug 05 Posts: 10874 Credit: 350,402 RAC: 0 |
In the meantime, I didn't read the link. Off the top of my head, the entropy of a system is calculated by the formula S= KBln(Omega). S (or entropy) is the number of possible ways the states of a system can be arranged and Omega is the number of states. KB is Boltzmann's constant. So you are just working out all the probable ways a system can be arranged. The more disorder, the more different arrangements there are. It is basically a statistical analysis of the probability of any one state being possible. And can someone please remind me how this fits in to the thread topic? Someone trotted out the old Intelligent Design argument about life breaking the law of Entropy thus proving the existence of a Designer. Reality Internet Personality |
Мишель Send message Joined: 26 Nov 13 Posts: 3073 Credit: 87,868 RAC: 0 |
My attempts to decrease my own entropy might be sapping the life from a 90 year old in Japan, or a walrus? Well, in our attempts to contain entropy we have been quite damaging to the environment. In a way, yes, your efforts to decrease your own entropy has probably sped up the entropy of something else. |
Sarge Send message Joined: 25 Aug 99 Posts: 12273 Credit: 8,569,109 RAC: 79 |
In the meantime, I didn't read the link. Thought that might be it. Returning to the above, so, what about John Nash's "zero sum"? Does that play into any of this? |
Bob DeWoody Send message Joined: 9 May 10 Posts: 3387 Credit: 4,182,900 RAC: 10 |
I have a question for the believers. Is God a NY Mets fan or a KC Royals fan? During the recent league championship baseball series on numerous occasions I saw a player making the sign of praising God after throwing a strike for the last out of an inning, and a player making the same gesture after swinging his bat and hitting a homerun and they were on different teams. You can substitute your own favorite game and players and the scene is essentially the same. Players thanking God for their success of the moment. In most cases I believe the player was sincere in his/her belief that God gave him/her the advantage. So, just whose side is God on. This can also be found in warfare, both sides thinking God is on their side to the point of sanctioning the killing and carnage. These are primitive actions and yet they persist here and now in the 21st century. When are people going to wake up and realise that a real God would not show such favoritism. Bob DeWoody My motto: Never do today what you can put off until tomorrow as it may not be required. This no longer applies in light of current events. |
Мишель Send message Joined: 26 Nov 13 Posts: 3073 Credit: 87,868 RAC: 0 |
I have a question for the believers. Is God a NY Mets fan or a KC Royals fan? During the recent league championship baseball series on numerous occasions I saw a player making the sign of praising God after throwing a strike for the last out of an inning, and a player making the same gesture after swinging his bat and hitting a homerun and they were on different teams. You can substitute your own favorite game and players and the scene is essentially the same. Players thanking God for their success of the moment. In most cases I believe the player was sincere in his/her belief that God gave him/her the advantage. So, just whose side is God on. This can also be found in warfare, both sides thinking God is on their side to the point of sanctioning the killing and carnage. These are primitive actions and yet they persist here and now in the 21st century. When are people going to wake up and realise that a real God would not show such favoritism. Well if both sides attribute their success to God, then clearly God shows no favoritism given that he helps out both sides, instead of letting one side steamwaltz over the other. Or perhaps God just loves to watch a more entertaining match and thus creates some artificial tension by letting both sides succeed more than they would otherwise do. After all, a match is more exciting if both teams have some success compared to watching a bunch of overpaid beefcakes fumble about. Or maybe its just player superstition, thinking that thanking God helps them get more successful. Or maybe its just good showmanship, pretending to be thanking God can make you look like a nicer guy to the audience, especially if the audience is very susceptible to little gestures that signify piety and humility. |
Es99 Send message Joined: 23 Aug 05 Posts: 10874 Credit: 350,402 RAC: 0 |
I am not familiar with that, although I have heard of it. Are you suggesting that religious belief could fall under the auspices of Game Theory? Reality Internet Personality |
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