Liberal or Conservative?

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Profile Gary Charpentier Crowdfunding Project Donor*Special Project $75 donorSpecial Project $250 donor
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Message 1701865 - Posted: 15 Jul 2015, 18:41:00 UTC

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Message 1701990 - Posted: 16 Jul 2015, 1:49:21 UTC - in response to Message 1701970.  

What if you tend to be Liberal, regarding Social Issues., and tend to be Conservative, regarding Economic Issues?


This quite funny to me, because this is how I see myself. Yet your recent posts to me indicate you believe me to be 100% liberal when in fact I identify more with Libertarianism (with a few notable exceptions).
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Message 1702028 - Posted: 16 Jul 2015, 4:16:33 UTC - in response to Message 1702006.  
Last modified: 16 Jul 2015, 4:17:07 UTC

What if you tend to be Liberal, regarding Social Issues., and tend to be Conservative, regarding Economic Issues?


This quite funny to me, because this is how I see myself. Yet your recent posts to me indicate you believe me to be 100% liberal when in fact I identify more with Libertarianism (with a few notable exceptions).

My 'Bad'.

I do apologize.

I am a Left Winger when it comes to understanding the Foundations of most Problems. But do not agree with most of their 'Solutions'. And especially the Foundation of their 'Solutions'.

If I understand how you describe yourself. Would we be considered Schizophrenic?

What would our brains show, if asked the same questions?


Because I am probably one of the few here with balanced hemispheres, I suspect you will never be able answer this question. :) :) :) :)

P.S.-that's an example of Ozz's idea of opening up. But I'm sure you'll do something like point out the dangers of near hemispherical balance. Don't worry, bud, I already read some of the reports about it.
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Message 1702050 - Posted: 16 Jul 2015, 5:17:37 UTC
Last modified: 16 Jul 2015, 5:19:03 UTC

Liberal or Conservative?


What's the difference ? nothing , there the same thing AKA: TONY ABBOT the P.M of Australia
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Message 1702053 - Posted: 16 Jul 2015, 5:36:53 UTC - in response to Message 1702050.  

Liberal or Conservative?


What's the difference ? nothing , there the same thing AKA: TONY ABBOT the P.M of Australia

I'll explain this a bit clearer, both words are considered the same thing here down under.

Which is why we're been going backwards the last 2 years with such a government as we presently have, which is both self named "Liberal" and extremely "Conservative".

In fact these represent those who want the rich to get richer and the poor to get poorer. :-(

Cheers.
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Message 1702060 - Posted: 16 Jul 2015, 5:54:26 UTC - in response to Message 1702053.  

Arrrr Wiggo ya should have let Gary try and figure that one out mate :-)
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Message 1702061 - Posted: 16 Jul 2015, 5:58:40 UTC - in response to Message 1702053.  

English, the common language that separates.
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Message 1702065 - Posted: 16 Jul 2015, 6:20:35 UTC

We should be going back to the polls next year. :-)

Cheers.
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Message 1702132 - Posted: 16 Jul 2015, 12:23:39 UTC - in response to Message 1702065.  

We should be going back to the polls next year. :-)

Cheers.


Can't wait Wiggo .

Bet he don't pull the double diss , polls got it at 54 Labor 46 LNP 2 party preferd

And if he keeps going with the GST increases then bye bye one term Tony and hopefully the whole front bench
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Message 1702139 - Posted: 16 Jul 2015, 12:51:40 UTC - in response to Message 1702006.  
Last modified: 16 Jul 2015, 12:59:23 UTC

This quite funny to me, because this is how I see myself. Yet your recent posts to me indicate you believe me to be 100% liberal when in fact I identify more with Libertarianism (with a few notable exceptions).

My 'Bad'.

I do apologize.


This is why some of your responses to others seem really flippant. As I said to you previously, you have put people into boxes they probably don't belong in simply because you disagreed with one or two of their positions, and you have assumed the rest of their viewpoints accordingly.

My guess is you probably noticed a time when I actually agreed with a liberal solution so you assumed my entire viewpoint was that of a liberal. I do have several viewpoints that coincide with liberals, so it would be easy to make that mistake, but it is dangerous to assume that all of my views are liberal. Most people are more complex than that, which is why the 'independants' are a large group in the U.S.

I am a Left Winger when it comes to understanding the Foundations of most Problems. But do not agree with most of their 'Solutions'. And especially the Foundation of their 'Solutions'.


Agreed. It really depends on the problem and which solution is the worse of two evils.

If I understand how you describe yourself. Would we be considered Schizophrenic? :) :) :)


Heh. No. It would mean we're likely progressive in our thinking (liberal), but pragmatic in our application of spending money.

What would our brains show, if asked the same questions?


Dancing monkeys vs chinchillas? :-P
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Message 1702165 - Posted: 16 Jul 2015, 15:13:37 UTC

Oh boy!!! I can't wait to tell my conservative family that my liberal lifestyle is not a "choice"!!!
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Message 1702186 - Posted: 16 Jul 2015, 16:28:53 UTC - in response to Message 1702165.  

Oh boy!!! I can't wait to tell my conservative family that my liberal lifestyle is not a "choice"!!!

Now we have some real debate! It's my DNA!

More interesting is the study showing that conservatives light up the fear center.
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Message 1702272 - Posted: 16 Jul 2015, 19:06:09 UTC - in response to Message 1702186.  

Now we have some real debate! It's my DNA!

More interesting is the study showing that conservatives light up the fear center.


It's nice to have a study backing what was already quite observable.
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Message 1702273 - Posted: 16 Jul 2015, 19:09:21 UTC
Last modified: 16 Jul 2015, 19:12:24 UTC

Now, now gentlemen... where would our species be without a fear center?

Extinct, I believe.


In the words of Dolly Levi, the delightful character from the musical Hello Dolly: "Money, pardon the expression, is like manure. It's not worth a thing unless it's spread around, encouraging young things to grow."
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Message 1702276 - Posted: 16 Jul 2015, 19:19:35 UTC - in response to Message 1702273.  

*shrug* No one said the fear center wasn't without value or merit. Just that some seem to indulge in it a bit too much.
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Message 1702281 - Posted: 16 Jul 2015, 19:40:46 UTC

... No one said the fear center wasn't without value or merit. ...

Point well made.


This quite funny to me, because this is how I see myself. Yet your recent posts to me indicate you believe me to be 100% liberal when in fact I identify more with Libertarianism (with a few notable exceptions).

The few libertarians I know personally are lovely people who, I believe, mistakenly assume that the rest of us are naturally just as lovely as they are themselves.

I'm actually quite serious about this. The libertarians I know donate generously to those in need, treat others with respect and dignity, give freely of their time and talents doing volunteer work and generally work each day to make this world a better place. The error of their ways is that they think that all the rest of us roll that way too.

Wouldn't it be nice if there were no laws requiring the redistribution of wealth, because everyone just gave freely until there were no more people in need?

Wouldn't it be nice if people were so decent to one another in their business relationships that a a free-market economy policed itself perfectly?

Wouldn't it be nice if there were no laws requiring us to behave decently to one another, because everyone was just naturally decent to his fellow man?

You may sign me up for your Libertarian Utopia, but I am not at all sure I would pass the entrance requirements...
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Message 1702297 - Posted: 16 Jul 2015, 20:38:21 UTC - in response to Message 1702281.  
Last modified: 16 Jul 2015, 20:39:03 UTC

The few libertarians I know personally are lovely people who, I believe, mistakenly assume that the rest of us are naturally just as lovely as they are themselves.

I'm actually quite serious about this. The libertarians I know donate generously to those in need, treat others with respect and dignity, give freely of their time and talents doing volunteer work and generally work each day to make this world a better place. The error of their ways is that they think that all the rest of us roll that way too.

Wouldn't it be nice if there were no laws requiring the redistribution of wealth, because everyone just gave freely until there were no more people in need?

Wouldn't it be nice if people were so decent to one another in their business relationships that a a free-market economy policed itself perfectly?

Wouldn't it be nice if there were no laws requiring us to behave decently to one another, because everyone was just naturally decent to his fellow man?

You may sign me up for your Libertarian Utopia, but I am not at all sure I would pass the entrance requirements...

You are describing those who are more commonly known as anarchists.

Those who have appropriated the term 'Libertarian', the likes such as Rand Paul, are closer to Objectivists, the philosophy developed by Ayn Rand. They would abhor what you just described as their 'libertarian utopia' mostly because their philosophy is entirely designed around extreme selfishness. For them wealth inequality, unfair business practices and acting like a massive a**hole to other people is really how they feel the world should work.

It used to be that Libertarians were more closely associated with Anarchists though. Its just that a certain group of American conservatives have hijacked the term and twisted it around. As I hear it, there are still Libertarians who call themselves Libertarians and who are angry at the fact that these days their name is associated with people like Ayn Rand and the Tea Party when in fact they would abhor those people and the platform they are advocating. To be fair to Ayn Rand, she too would absolutely abhor the tea party and probably hate the fact that they are trying to associate themselves with her and her work.
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Message 1702319 - Posted: 16 Jul 2015, 21:39:19 UTC - in response to Message 1702281.  

... No one said the fear center wasn't without value or merit. ...

Point well made.


This quite funny to me, because this is how I see myself. Yet your recent posts to me indicate you believe me to be 100% liberal when in fact I identify more with Libertarianism (with a few notable exceptions).

The few libertarians I know personally are lovely people who, I believe, mistakenly assume that the rest of us are naturally just as lovely as they are themselves.

I'm actually quite serious about this. The libertarians I know donate generously to those in need, treat others with respect and dignity, give freely of their time and talents doing volunteer work and generally work each day to make this world a better place. The error of their ways is that they think that all the rest of us roll that way too.

Wouldn't it be nice if there were no laws requiring the redistribution of wealth, because everyone just gave freely until there were no more people in need?

Wouldn't it be nice if people were so decent to one another in their business relationships that a a free-market economy policed itself perfectly?

Wouldn't it be nice if there were no laws requiring us to behave decently to one another, because everyone was just naturally decent to his fellow man?

You may sign me up for your Libertarian Utopia, but I am not at all sure I would pass the entrance requirements...

I am rather sure few would pass the entrance requirements.

But what is a person in need? Someone who doesn't have his next meal or someone who can only afford basic cable? Need vs. want is the dividing line. I doubt a poor nomadic bush person even wants an unlimited cable package and a 120" big screen. But I can see that in someone who lives in a city. Marketing has made us claim need status for so many items that should be in the want status; the debate is now helplessly skewed.

I'm poor, I need a personal bizjet
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Message 1702373 - Posted: 17 Jul 2015, 1:31:42 UTC

What if you tend to be Liberal, regarding Social Issues., and tend to be Conservative, regarding Economic Issues?


That is an impossibility. Who will pay for the social "issues" when there is a high percentage of those on the dole who will not work or cannot find a job.

Socialism might only work in a homogeneous society where everyone has a work ethic and can find a job.
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Message 1702385 - Posted: 17 Jul 2015, 2:33:35 UTC - in response to Message 1702373.  

What if you tend to be Liberal, regarding Social Issues., and tend to be Conservative, regarding Economic Issues?


That is an impossibility. Who will pay for the social "issues" when there is a high percentage of those on the dole who will not work or cannot find a job.


I think you are confusing economic conservatism with Ebenezer Scroogism. In the example you bring up, a socially liberal yet economic conservative doesn't have to choose denying people a social safety net (yes, there are many conservatives that do). It can also mean choosing pragmatic limits to prevent abuse of the system in place designed to help those truly in need*.


*Yes, I realize "pragmatic limits" and "need" are both undefined terms and are decided upon by a society that agrees what the definitions should be through civil discourse.
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