I have no need of drugs, recreational or hard, perhaps I should consider myself very lucky. And no, we are not considering alcohol or tobacco in the classification of "drugs".

Stop talking for others when you mean yourself.

And no, we are not considering alcohol or tobacco in the classification of "drugs".

What? Tobacco is almost as addictive as Heroine!

And coffe is addictive as well but not lethal:)

And no, we are not considering alcohol or tobacco in the classification of "drugs".

What? Tobacco is almost as addictive as Heroine!

Most definitely: -
We have...
Boadicea
Joan of Arc
Annie Oakley
Amelia Earhart
Edith Cavell

What causes someone to try a hard drug? I've tried pot, and it's ok, but not really my thing, however if it was legal in my state, I'd probably give it another shot. Now, on the other hand, if cocaine or heroin was legal, I don't think I'd try it because those "hard drugs" scare me a little bit.

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The mind is a weird and mysterious place

What causes someone to try a hard drug? I've tried pot, and it's ok, but not really my thing, however if it was legal in my state, I'd probably give it another shot. Now, on the other hand, if cocaine or heroin was legal, I don't think I'd try it because those "hard drugs" scare me a little bit.

Good admission. Just what is it about the hard drugs that scare you?

DG (message 1661433),

Excellent points. There really is no one single definition of 'hard' drug. Different definitions use different criteria.

About Caffeine, I agree. It likely should be regulated, not only for the reason you gave, but also others. It might not be exactly as harmless as many think it is.

Chris S (message 1661440),

Soft drugs are classed as non-addictive and semi-legal, or not enforced too much.

Try telling that to all the people in US Prisons over weed-related charges.

And no, we are not considering alcohol or tobacco in the classification of "drugs".

Oh, they ARE drugs, even by your definition of drugs:

drugs are "substances imbibed into the body, orally or by injection"

Caffeine is a drug too.

Janneseti (message 1661443),

What? Tobacco is almost as addictive as Heroine!

And coffe is addictive as well but not lethal:)

I agree, presuming you meant Heroin, and not Heroine.

I have known people addicted to both Nicotine(tobacco) and Heroin. Most have told me that between the two, getting off of nicotine was more difficult.

I do not know if it was because to them the Nicotine was actually more addictive, or if it was because Nicotine(tobacco) use was not only legal but also more socially acceptable.

About coffee, the caffeine in coffee can produce dependency. Tell me about it. I have three children, with rather high energy levels. At my age, my energy level is not nearly as high, so I need help keeping up with them. When I don't get my morning coffee, not only is my energy level way low, but I am more than a little... grumpy.

There are other reasons why coffee may not be wise, at least for certain people. In addition to caffeine's effect as a CNS stimulant, some studies have shown a link between high consumption of coffee in women and breast cancer. If there *IS* a link, perhaps it is due to the caffeine.

But in any case, consumption of caffeine can, due to its stimulant effect aggravate certain heart conditions and kidney problems in some people. So, it would perhaps be best for everyone to cut down on caffeine consumption.

Perhaps Sugar should be considered a drug(hard? soft?)due to it's proven addictive nature and the lethal results of overuse, Diabetes and Obesity.

As to the circumstances of first use, the fact is people try drugs and continue use because they FEEL GOOD.

Full disclosure, in the last 45 years I, personally, have experienced Cannabis, LSD, Mescaline and Mushrooms(early 70's hippie), Cocaine(80's 'club hopper') Benzedrine(college study binges), and of course Caffeine and Alcohol. Cocaine being the hardest to 'kick the habit'.

I've never injected(hate needles)which probably saved my life.

I currently use Cannabis(legal in Colorado) as an analgesic for back pain(and I do enjoy the euphoric nature of that use).

The point being people are unique, and all have an 'addictive personalty' to some substance or philosophy. The choice of what is acceptable is determined by the society in which they reside.

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"Sour Grapes make a bitter Whine." <(0)>

Janneseti (message 1661443),

What? Tobacco is almost as addictive as Heroine!
And coffe is addictive as well but not lethal:)

I agree, presuming you meant Heroin, and not Heroine.

I have known people addicted to both Nicotine(tobacco) and Heroin. Most have told me that between the two, getting off of nicotine was more difficult.

I do not know if it was because to them the Nicotine was actually more addictive, or if it was because Nicotine(tobacco) use was not only legal but also more socially acceptable.

About coffee, the caffeine in coffee can produce dependency. Tell me about it. I have three children, with rather high energy levels. At my age, my energy level is not nearly as high, so I need help keeping up with them. When I don't get my morning coffee, not only is my energy level way low, but I am more than a little... grumpy.

There are other reasons why coffee may not be wise, at least for certain people. In addition to caffeine's effect as a CNS stimulant, some studies have shown a link between high consumption of coffee in women and breast cancer. If there *IS* a link, perhaps it is due to the caffeine.

But in any case, consumption of caffeine can, due to its stimulant effect aggravate certain heart conditions and kidney problems in some people. So, it would perhaps be best for everyone to cut down on caffeine consumption.

Oops Heroine is a female Hero:)

And coffee is also addictive.

PG13, eh?

Remember who was starting this thread.

Also this subject has been discussed before and it is in fact a quite important one.

Perhaps it should be appropriate to make a distinction between drugs and medicine.

Some types or drugs are meant to be addictive. Others are meant for cure and recovery.

Some medicines have been syntethically manufactured or produced. Even alchohol is a possible addictive substance which most of the time is being consumed in order to obtain peace and satisfaction.

At times such a consumption becomes misuse instead.

You always have to choose between different flavors when it comes to these things.

Also there may be something in between the different end of the scales.

Definitely there are always things around which are meeting someones needs.

Whether or not it is being allowed or permitted is another subject.

At least freedom of expression and speech makes it a possibility for you to voice your opinion when it comes to particular matters.

But apparently not so when it comes to strong language.

Edit: janneseti gets it right when mentioning coffee, of course.

There seems to be some confusion of exactly what is a drug and what isn't. There are a variety of definitions available. Here is one that might be applicable:

From the Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act, now:
US Code, Title 21, Chapter 9, Subchapter II, Section 321:

http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/USCODE-2010-title21/pdf/USCODE-2010-title21-chap9-subchapII-sec321.pdf

(g)(1) The term ‘‘drug’’ means (A) articles recognized in the official United States Pharmacopoeia, official Homoeopathic Pharmacopoeia of the United States, or official National Formulary, or any supplement to any of them; and
(B) articles intended for use in the diagnosis, cure, mitigation, treatment, or prevention of disease in man or other animals; and
(C) articles (other than food) intended to affect the structure or any function of the body of man or other animals; and
(D) articles intended for use as a component of any article specified in clause (A), (B), or (C).

Ok, most of the illegal drugs, including the 'hard' ones, are going to fit either under (A) or (C). Cannabis is going to also fit under (B) as well, since... well.. 'medical marijuana'.
Ethanol (alcohol) is going to fit under at least (D) since it is used as a component of a variety of other drugs.
Caffeine is going to fit under at least (D) as well, as it is a component of certain over-the-counter pain relievers / fever reducers, for instance 'Anacin'.
Nicotine is definitely covered by (A)

Sugar has been mentioned. Sucrose (table sugar) is covered by (A). Yes, it is a drug, as is glucose. Both are covered by (B) as well, and likely (D).

I am sure that other nations have somewhat similar legal definitions of the term 'drug' (or whatever it is referred to in their language, if not English.

But, like I said about hard drugs. If they are not covered by (A) or (B), they will be covered by (C).

As a former mod - we had our ways of sorting out such issues as obscenity in a foreign language.
But that is a million miles from a sensible discussion about hard drugs.
Years ago, when I was first a student, a group of us were involved in a "care" project - we would tour some of the worst areas in East London, and because we were students we were trusted by the addicts, they would tell us things about themselves, and fellow addicts which they would never tell the authorities. We knew where to look for the young girl who was threatening to end it all with a massive over dose, the one who had accidentally over dosed and more, much more. We would collect these unfortunates and deposit them at the local hospital. Where they were treated for the immediate symptoms, but rarely fr the underlying cause of their problems that had led them into the state they were in. It was heartbreaking to collect the same youngster (even by our own age group many that we contacted were youngsters...) on more than one occasion. We did our best by showing that someone cared for them, and when we could we got some better able help for them. But we couldn't help them all.
There are several things that frighten me about hard drugs, like how easy it is to become addicted, the physiological and physical affects of use, how hard it is to get realistic help for addicts.....


[edit]
To add: The main drug in use at the time was heroin, with some cocaine, but that was generally too expensive for "the kids on the street" we were trying to help.
And
I wouldn't go after the users, but those that profit from the users (but probably not go after them in the way that a group of dock workers went after a pusher who they caught pushing to sub-eleven year - his body was found "tangled up" in ropes between a couple of Thames lighters.

---

Bob Smith
Member of Seti PIPPS (Pluto is a Planet Protest Society)
Somewhere in the (un)known Universe?

There seems to be some confusion of exactly what is a drug and what isn't. There are a variety of definitions available. Here is one that might be applicable:

From the Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act, now:
US Code, Title 21, Chapter 9, Subchapter II, Section 321:

http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/USCODE-2010-title21/pdf/USCODE-2010-title21-chap9-subchapII-sec321.pdf

(g)(1) The term ‘‘drug’’ means (A) articles recognized in the official United States Pharmacopoeia, official Homoeopathic Pharmacopoeia of the United States, or official National Formulary, or any supplement to any of them; and
(B) articles intended for use in the diagnosis, cure, mitigation, treatment, or prevention of disease in man or other animals; and
(C) articles (other than food) intended to affect the structure or any function of the body of man or other animals; and
(D) articles intended for use as a component of any article specified in clause (A), (B), or (C).

Sugar has been mentioned. Sucrose (table sugar) is covered by (A). Yes, it is a drug, as is glucose. Both are covered by (B) as well, and likely (D).

I note the clauses are connected by the word "and"

Clause C exempts food. Sugar is sold as food. With the "and" connection, Boolean logic has "false" and "true" results in "false". Or is the use of the "and" connection to imply the union of sets? This is the huge problem of putting pen to paper in the English language and making everyone understand what is meant.

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Good point. I understand it to mean 'a union of sets'. The existence of (D) implies it is interpreted this way. Your mileage may vary.

And English is lacking specifics oftentimes.

As to sugar, it is sold as both food and in forms more medically intended. It is sort of a dual use compound. It both is and isn't. They are in the Formulary, therefore (A), it is used in the treatment of medical conditions, namely hypoglycemia so it is (B), and it is a component of other drugs, at times, so it catches (D) as well. *shrug*

Back to hard drugs... Care to shoot off a definition of them, or to otherwise comment?

The Likely Cause of Addiction Has Been Discovered, and It Is Not What You Think

I think the recent interest of an old rat study could throw some light on the nature of drug addiction.

The rats with good lives didn't like the drugged water. They mostly shunned it, consuming less than a quarter of the drugs the isolated rats used. None of them died. While all the rats who were alone and unhappy became heavy users, none of the rats who had a happy environment did.

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Reality Internet Personality

FDA regulations are not used in the States only.
Every worldwide medical company and there third part suppliers has to comply to the FDA to be credible.

U.S. Food and Drug Administration
Protecting and Promoting Your Health
http://www.fda.gov/

Examples from my work experience:)
Astra Zeneca.
http://www.astrazeneca.se/home
Fresenius Kabi.
http://www.fresenius-kabi.se/

Real drugs and hard drugs.

The Likely Cause of Addiction Has Been Discovered, and It Is Not What You Think

I think the recent interest of an old rat study could throw some light on the nature of drug addiction.

The rats with good lives didn't like the drugged water. They mostly shunned it, consuming less than a quarter of the drugs the isolated rats used. None of them died. While all the rats who were alone and unhappy became heavy users, none of the rats who had a happy environment did.

I have also seen these reports ES99.
It's truly Amazing.

And I have read stories from India where elephants are going berserk after drinking a farmers homemade rice-wine...

Hopefully, we don't get into a 'Google Translation' problem.

We will until Goggle and Bing get there act together

Here's the deal.
In Italy Happy Easter is called Bouna Pasqua.
Very much like in Spain.
But if you use Goggle Translate if that text is in Finnish it would be translated to "Holy Skit"

Personally, I feel the distinction between "soft" & "hard" drugs is pure B/S.

Drug use is just that & regardless of its pliability, users become paranoid towards "normal" people. Users also distrust non-users & go out of their way to condone their actions...

I tend to agree with this, the Rat Study ES99 cited would seem to be a self-sustaining and reinforcing behavior given the isolation that Paranoia causes.

I feel that the disposition toward addiction is not just caused by external environment but also has an internal component either physical (such as the link between parental and offspring alcoholism) or psychological. Those lucky enough to have retrieved themselves(because only they can make the decision), from the hell of addiction frequently replace the addiction with another 'crutch'(not meant in a bad way} such as the AA, or 12 Step program or Religion.

There is nothing wrong with a crutch as it helps the infirm deal with life, unless that crutch is destructive to the infirm or their family.

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"Sour Grapes make a bitter Whine." <(0)>

So, please people... Discussion of "hard drugs" is ok with me, I suppose. Advocating their use is not. Please, let us not go there.

+1

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rOZZ
Music
Pictures

All Drugs Legal. Gubment Run 'Opium Dens' fO The People. Free Medical and Psyche Care On Site. Plus Free Internet, Entertainment-movies and such-and Food, On Site. Drugs Nominal Cost.

Cost would be 1/1000 Spent on 'Drug' 'Wars'.

Be Like 'Paradise'.

Welcome To The City, We Got Fun and Games.

Yep.

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May we All have a METAMORPHOSIS. REASON. GOoD JUDGEMENT and LOVE and ORDER!!!!!