I am pleased to see Intel fined, as am I with Microsoft, selling their OS with a MS browser and a MS media player etc, good to see them being fined more than once.

On a slightly unrelated note Internet Explorer has to be the WORST web browser their is, why is it not standard html complient? What's with the frequent holes in its security? Anyway...

As for SATAN's comments about "spending Great Britain's £40 million pounds every day" that reminds me of the BNP flyer that come around election time.

Maybe SATAN could tell me if that's gross or net? Also if this is based on the actual figures from the treasury department? Oh and if that includes the rebate the EU gives back to us?

I appreciate it may be difficult for some people not to fully understand that when dealing on a national scale just how much money is alot of money.

So just to help put this in perspective...

"we’re having to pay £31 billion a year merely to service the INTEREST on our debt. That’s not *pay off* our debt – just keep up with the interest. Christ!

In other words, the EU costs us 7.75 times LESS than it does to keep the international bailiffs from the door. (And that £31 billion was BEFORE the most recent round of government borrowing, and before the collapse of sterling, both of which will have hugely escalated the figure for this year, as and when it’s released.)"

There is an interesting article you may be interested in reading: http://www.jcm.org.uk/blog/?p=2184

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www.artpruple.co.uk

I am pleased to see Intel fined, as am I with Microsoft, selling their OS with a MS browser and a MS media player etc, good to see them being fined more than once.

The nerve of them! Make them pay money to teach them a lesson!

On a slightly unrelated note Internet Explorer has to be the WORST web browser their is, why is it not standard html complient? What's with the frequent holes in its security? Anyway...

What's with the frequent holes in Firefox and all the minor updates to it's code anyway?

(Typing this from a FireFox 3.5.2 web browser)

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I am pleased to see Intel fined, as am I with Microsoft, selling their OS with a MS browser and a MS media player etc, good to see them being fined more than once.

The nerve of them! Make them pay money to teach them a lesson!

On a slightly unrelated note Internet Explorer has to be the WORST web browser their is, why is it not standard html complient? What's with the frequent holes in its security? Anyway...

What's with the frequent holes in Firefox and all the minor updates to it's code anyway?

(Typing this from a FireFox 3.5.2 web browser)

Hitting them in the wallet is the only thing that will make them change their monopolising stratagies.

I hear less in the news about FF, one problem which only relates to IE is the fact that it's more integrated to the OS, so a problem (virus etc) via IE is more likely to screw up the OS.

Though there are many choices other than FF or IE. If you fancy a change why not try one of the following:

konqueror
Safari
Opera
Netscape
Chrome

N.B This is by no means a comprehensive list.

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www.artpruple.co.uk

Hitting them in the wallet is the only thing that will make them change their monopolising stratagies.

I would have to disagree that this is their strategy. Its every business's goal, or you could even say best interest to keep increasing their sales numbers. Where else can you go once you're at the top?

I hear less in the news about FF

Like Linux, that's because there's more interest (and more advertising revenue created by click-throughs) from anything Microsoft.

one problem which only relates to IE is the fact that it's more integrated to the OS, so a problem (virus etc) via IE is more likely to screw up the OS.

Not true with Windows Vista and Windows 7. IE has been de-integrated from those OSes as part of Microsoft's focus on security.

Though there are many choices other than FF or IE. If you fancy a change why not try one of the following:

konqueror
Safari
Opera
Netscape
Chrome

N.B This is by no means a comprehensive list.

I've used Opera, Netscape, Avant Browser, Enigma, and NeoPlanet. Personally, the skins of NeoPlanet were the best, but there was no interest in the browser itself and so development ceased on the project.

However, my point wasn't to say that I was unhappy with FF, only to state that all of them have their issues and bugs. I'd say that with IE's decoupling of the browser from the OS and IE8's better standards compliance than previous iterations make it a decent offering. I tried it for a while and liked a few features, but I went back to FF because the 3.5 series added some of those same features that IE8 had plus it doesn't allow ActiveX controls to run without user knowledge (or a prompt at the top of the bar like in IE8).

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Hitting them in the wallet is the only thing that will make them change their monopolising stratagies.

I would have to disagree that this is their strategy. Its every business's goal, or you could even say best interest to keep increasing their sales numbers. Where else can you go once you're at the top?

I hear less in the news about FF

Like Linux, that's because there's more interest (and more advertising revenue created by click-throughs) from anything Microsoft.

one problem which only relates to IE is the fact that it's more integrated to the OS, so a problem (virus etc) via IE is more likely to screw up the OS.

Not true with Windows Vista and Windows 7. IE has been de-integrated from those OSes as part of Microsoft's focus on security.

Though there are many choices other than FF or IE. If you fancy a change why not try one of the following:

konqueror
Safari
Opera
Netscape
Chrome

N.B This is by no means a comprehensive list.

I've used Opera, Netscape, Avant Browser, Enigma, and NeoPlanet. Personally, the skins of NeoPlanet were the best, but there was no interest in the browser itself and so development ceased on the project.

However, my point wasn't to say that I was unhappy with FF, only to state that all of them have their issues and bugs. I'd say that with IE's decoupling of the browser from the OS and IE8's better standards compliance than previous iterations make it a decent offering. I tried it for a while and liked a few features, but I went back to FF because the 3.5 series added some of those same features that IE8 had plus it doesn't allow ActiveX controls to run without user knowledge (or a prompt at the top of the bar like in IE8).

Indeed it is their goal but they (by law) have to do it without breaching anti-competition rules.

Because of their focus on security or because they keep getting sued? Why weren't they focusing on security way back when FF was? They are sorting it out now because it's been brought to public attention that there are more secure browsers and their market share is being reduced.

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www.artpruple.co.uk

Indeed it is their goal but they (by law) have to do it without breaching anti-competition rules.

Absolutely, and that's for the courts to decide. When a company breaks the law, they must pay the consequence. It would seem that only the EU thinks Intel and Microsoft have done something wrong (well, AMD is still at the beginning of their lawsuit case against Intel in the US, so it has yet to unfold).

I've seen many smaller companies that breach anti-competition rules and no one bothers to sue them because there is nothing to be gained from doing so. Its only big news when a corporate giant breaks the law, it would seem.

Because of their focus on security or because they keep getting sued? Why weren't they focusing on security way back when FF was? They are sorting it out now because it's been brought to public attention that there are more secure browsers and their market share is being reduced.

Because, admittedly, their own success had caused them to become stagnant, and competition helps everyone, and yes, the negative public attention is not good press for any company. But I doubt the less than 1% loss in market share has anything to do with their motives or has caused any real concern within the company. I've seen many Mac and Linux users brag about market share, but the numbers don't seem to reflect the claims.

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Indeed it is their goal but they (by law) have to do it without breaching anti-competition rules.

Absolutely, and that's for the courts to decide. When a company breaks the law, they must pay the consequence. It would seem that only the EU thinks Intel and Microsoft have done something wrong (well, AMD is still at the beginning of their lawsuit case against Intel in the US, so it has yet to unfold).

I've seen many smaller companies that breach anti-competition rules and no one bothers to sue them because there is nothing to be gained from doing so. Its only big news when a corporate giant breaks the law, it would seem.

Because of their focus on security or because they keep getting sued? Why weren't they focusing on security way back when FF was? They are sorting it out now because it's been brought to public attention that there are more secure browsers and their market share is being reduced.

Because, admittedly, their own success had caused them to become stagnant, and competition helps everyone, and yes, the negative public attention is not good press for any company. But I doubt the less than 1% loss in market share has anything to do with their motives or has caused any real concern within the company. I've seen many Mac and Linux users brag about market share, but the numbers don't seem to reflect the claims.

Linux/Unix has a good market share with business servers.

FF market share of web browsers (non business) is pretty good and growing:

July 2009

View Trend MS IE 67.68%
View Trend Firefox 22.47%
View Trend Safari 4.07%
View Trend Chrome 2.59%
View Trend Opera 1.97%
View Trend Netscape 0.67%
View Trend Opera Mini 0.29%

Bit more than 1%!

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www.artpruple.co.uk

Linux/Unix has a good market share with business servers.

Yes, with servers because servers are maintained by advanced, educated people who have gone to school to know how to do this stuff (by the way, I am a Microsoft Certified Systems Administrator). Linux is a very solid OS for running web, file and database servers with excellent performance.

FF market share of web browsers (non business) is pretty good and growing:

July 2009

View Trend MS IE 67.68%
View Trend Firefox 22.47%
View Trend Safari 4.07%
View Trend Chrome 2.59%
View Trend Opera 1.97%
View Trend Netscape 0.67%
View Trend Opera Mini 0.29%

Bit more than 1%!

FF isn't exactly Linux, which is what I specifically referred to by loss in market share. But yes, FF has gained quite a bit of ground in the browser market, and its a great browser to use too! Would FF have as much of a market share if it didn't have a Windows application, and was only available on Linux or Mac? I highly doubt it. Nonetheless, competition is good for all around. However, I find it funny that some of the latest features in FF 3.5.x are taken from IE8... is FF now playing catch up? :) (No, I really don't think so, but it would seem that way!)

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Yes I know it's not Linux but correct me if I'm wrong but it is open source (or so t'internet says).

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www.artpruple.co.uk

Yes I know it's not Linux but correct me if I'm wrong but it is open source (or so t'internet says).

Yes, of course it is. But, as I said, I was referring to people switching away from Windows to Mac or Linux, not that Open Source wasn't making any headway in any market segment with my comment.

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Ah, ok fair enough.

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www.artpruple.co.uk