With the "prefered" version of BOINC being 4.43. We all know it's got some big bugs - as JM7 has posted that he fixed "this and that"..

ROM has posted that "some of JM7's fixes were included in the dev build 4.44". (and not defining which were included and which weren't!) Now we hear about dev build 4.45!

It just seems to me, that as the push continues to get people off classic, a MINIMUM requirement would be a released and stable version of BOINC! (and 4.43 just doesn't seem to be that!)

BOINC has been running in production (not beta) for about a year. Has there been more than a couple weeks straight where there hasn't been a new "official" version or a new test version? (don't forget the whole 4.6x thing!)

That was the thing about classic. when you joined the project (in the last 2-3 years at least) there was something you could just "load and go". Boinc has what, a 18 month beta and a year of production, and the folks that are migrating from classic now still have to deal with 4.43/4.44/4.45/4.19/4.26?

I bet I know exactly why the Classic shutdown is being pushed while the CC seems to be in a state of flux.. UCB is, well, a University, and I'll bet the staffing will reduce/change over the summer months. That's reality. People do graduate from a university, and May/June seems to be a popular time...

I've been vocal about some of the shortcomings with BOINC since the betatest. I'll admit that I've been wrong at times, but will also state, not at all times!

ONE BIG DIFFERENCE I see with Seti/Boinc and the other Boinc progects, is that with the other BOINC projects, is "the person in charge" of other BOINC projects posts to forums to let folks know what's going on and answer/debate questions.

What we hear from Anderson is second, third, or n-th hand... Things like "Dave really likes the new scheduler and won't back it out". Will Dave himself ever make any statement in public, in "is own" forums, and catch the flack for a bad one? I'll bet not. It just seems the Anderson theory is that too many folks are crunching Seti anyway, so what if 100,000 drop away with this "improvement". "Let them eat cake" in other words....


Dave - interact with the people that are contributing time and resources for YOUR project!

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You make some interesting remarks and pretty much I second you on some. As someone who has crunched SETI Classic since 2000, I was in for a rude-awakening when I downloaded BOINC 4.0x and had to adjust to it. Luckily, people here were friendly,(much more friendly than what the Classic people give them credit for.) Paul Buck's site is head-and-shoulders above the rest of the sites currently existing and he actually took the time to explain things to me. You get a way better response when you actually try hard, show people you're trying, and have an open mind. That's the key and that's why I'm still crunching away on my Laptop here and just pushed past the 32,000K after 6 months. :)

Also, though, remember that the people in charge of the program have a lot more on their hands than the other BOINC projects. It would be a refreshing thing to see something from the "man" himself but that's why he has assistants: they are in charge of getting the message out to the people. President Bush doesn't get involved with the day to day runnings of the country but rather has intermediaries be the public face of the administration. Same principle here. When it's needed, he will make a statement but for the most part, hearing from Ron and the others are just as good. Plus, the added bonus of all of this is that those people have more hands-on knowledge of what's happening since not all information can head to the top man all the time. Simply not possible and/or feasible.

Welcome aboard, crunch away, and keep an open mind on this. Some people complained that we weren't getting any information period. You're just one step away from that, complaining about not hearing from one person, when others are getting the exact message he would be delivering anyway but with more insight. :)

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Dave - interact with the people that are contributing time and resources for YOUR project!

He does regularly answer questions and on occasion discuss design options in the e-mail lists ... sign up for the developer and project e-mail lists ...

I will say that he will not be likely to answer questions posed in the "Have you stopped beating your wife?" tone.

And, Azwoody, you indeed have been right at times. Yet, mostly what I think of when I think of you is hostility and a negative attitude. In the past you have correctly identified me with the group of people you call "Cheerleaders" and I am proud of that label, because I am a cheerleader... I see positive things in BOINC. It is not all wine and roses, but it is also not the ultimate in, um, heck, as you would be prone to paint it.

Just as an aside, I will also point out that I was a systems engineer, and like most good engineers I am always looking for the "Bad", mostly so it is identified and can be fixed. This propensity of looking for the things that are wrong is amplified by my depression which does not respond well to medication.

But, all in all, BOINC Works. I am running a mix of versions, primarily 4.25, 4.43, and one 4.44 ... I grant that there are still issues with the WOrk Scheduler and what JM VII is trying to accomplish. But, it does do basically what is intended. Yes, there are bugs, and there are features I am not sure I like yet as I too like to have a full "bag" from all the projects. But I am not ready to condemn it, or the people working on it ...

Anyway, I just wanted to say that you can be more persuasive with a little less, um, passion and enthusiasm ...

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I think this is the reason you still see 4.19 listed. I think 4.19 should be labeled "stable" and 4.4x should be labeled development. IMHO!!!

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I'd rather speak my mind because it hurts too much to bite my tongue.

American Spirit BBQ Proudly Serving those that courageously defend freedom.

Dave - interact with the people that are contributing time and resources for YOUR project!

He does regularly answer questions and on occasion discuss design options in the e-mail lists ... sign up for the developer and project e-mail lists ...

I will say that he will not be likely to answer questions posed in the "Have you stopped beating your wife?" tone.

Paul... Step away from the pompoms...

Anderson answers NO ONE on these forums. He never adresses ANYONE except developers, and why should we all join that list to understand what the "person in charge" says about the project? That's my point.. I know some of the releases have been a mess, and I know some have been good, but not seen a SINGLE post from Anderson - about anything.

On other projects, the "person in charge" posts real info. I know you know it, as I see you on the other project forums. We hear JM7 saying "Dave really likes the scheduler and it won't change", but we don't hear Dave saying that! Look at PP,CP,LHC, Einstein, and you'll see posts from the "person in charge". Can you point me at ONE case in the last 3 months that Dave himself has made any contact with the general user base (i.e. people providing for free, the CPU time for HIS project)?

"Let them eat cake"

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I think this is the reason you still see 4.19 listed. I think 4.19 should be labeled "stable" and 4.4x should be labeled development. IMHO!!!

Couldn't agree more... The current "stable" release has been shown to not be stable... Why is this such a strange concept to the folks at UCB?

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Paul... Step away from the pompoms...

Hmmm, nice to know that you are consistent. And I will point out that I too am a vocal critic of many aspects of BOINC, but that does not stop me from seeing the value in the current system. Nor from trying to do my part to make the system as a whole better.

Anderson answers NO ONE on these forums. He never adresses ANYONE except developers, and why should we all join that list to understand what the "person in charge" says about the project? That's my point.. I know some of the releases have been a mess, and I know some have been good, but not seen a SINGLE post from Anderson - about anything.

I, for one, would much prefer that he, Rom, JM VII, etc,; official and volunteer
Developers spend their time developing ...

I mean, do we want them talking about the system, or making it better. I vote for making it better.

But on a side note, when appropriate, Rom, Matt, and others do answer questions. They do not answer attacks. I don't blame them ...

On other projects, the "person in charge" posts real info. I know you know it, as I see you on the other project forums. We hear JM7 saying "Dave really likes the scheduler and it won't change", but we don't hear Dave saying that! Look at PP,CP,LHC, Einstein, and you'll see posts from the "person in charge". Can you point me at ONE case in the last 3 months that Dave himself has made any contact with the general user base (i.e. people providing for free, the CPU time for HIS project)?

Yes, and even then they are often attacked for not answering fast enough.

As far as contacting the general user base, well, I told you of one place where he does ... so, why won't you subscribe? It is open for all. And if you did, you would see that he does indeed address the general participant when a vaild question is raised and it is in his current area of effort.

"Let them eat cake"

Um, yes indeed ... lets whack him over the head, or anyone else you don't agree with, and expect positive dialog.

Well, I tried. But, Azwoody, you would rather attack than listen. So, I shall not waste more of my time with this. But, with one last try, read your answer to me from my perspective and see if you really like the way it comes across ...

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Dave - interact with the people that are contributing time and resources for YOUR project!

He does regularly answer questions and on occasion discuss design options in the e-mail lists ... sign up for the developer and project e-mail lists ...

I will say that he will not be likely to answer questions posed in the "Have you stopped beating your wife?" tone.

Paul... Step away from the pompoms...

Anderson answers NO ONE on these forums. He never adresses ANYONE except developers, and why should we all join that list to understand what the "person in charge" says about the project? That's my point.. I know some of the releases have been a mess, and I know some have been good, but not seen a SINGLE post from Anderson - about anything.

On other projects, the "person in charge" posts real info. I know you know it, as I see you on the other project forums. We hear JM7 saying "Dave really likes the scheduler and it won't change", but we don't hear Dave saying that! Look at PP,CP,LHC, Einstein, and you'll see posts from the "person in charge". Can you point me at ONE case in the last 3 months that Dave himself has made any contact with the general user base (i.e. people providing for free, the CPU time for HIS project)?

"Let them eat cake"

And do you think that all the hostility you show is a warm invitation for D.A. to come and post?

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98SE XP2500+ @ 2.1 GHz Boinc v5.8.8

And God said"Let there be light."But then the program crashed because he was trying to access the 'light' property of a NULL universe pointer.

AZwoody, please crawl back under whatever rock...you make me ashamed to be from Arizona.

Yes you make some valid points...but you are one of the biggest A**holes around.

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